No joke.

26 Responses to “No joke.”

1. Emmy on July 15th, 2008 11:49 am

   I think everyone who puts themselves into the public eye allows it to be open season on their personal life. I assume Obama was ready for it. I do think people are more at risk for being called racist if they make jokes about him, but only because he’s the only non-white candidate to ever get this far.

   I don’t really find the cover humorous though. Obama himself was never Muslim, so picturing him as Muslim is just inaccurate not really funny. I’ve seen pictures of Hillary portrayed in almost the same way as Michelle is and find it equally disturbing. It bothers me that strong women are portrayed as militant.

   As for his church. Well, call it racist or call it what it is - something most people aren’t brave enough to admit. We are far from being a nation of equality.

   But, I’m guessing they were both prepared for all of these things and more.

2. republitarian on July 15th, 2008 12:37 pm

   “I think everyone who puts themselves into the public eye allows it to be open season on their personal life.”

   You weren’t singing that tune a month ago…..

3. Jeremy Aldrich on July 15th, 2008 12:41 pm

   Amazing that you don’t see a difference between a former local elected official and someone who wants to be president. Question: does running for office mean we should publicly scrutinize the details of your private life and past, or does that only apply to people who win?

4. Republitarian on July 15th, 2008 12:45 pm

   Applies to everyone.

5. Emmy on July 15th, 2008 1:08 pm

   And funny, I never put myself into the public eye, but you didn’t mind putting my personal life out there.

   It doesn’t apply to everyone and I’m sorry you can’t see the difference between a local treasurer and a presidential candidate. Or the difference between major news outlets and an irrelevant blogger. Oh well.

6. Right Field on July 15th, 2008 7:31 pm

   Whackette, you’re absolutely right. There IS a lot to joke about, but there is a palpable fear of being labeled a racist that prevents us from doing to Obama what we do to every politican, Democrat, Republican, or otherwise. McCain has certainly been the target of much ridicule, as has Bush…but they’re just old white guys, so its ok.

   Emmy, I’m confused by this statement: “As for his church. Well, call it racist or call it what it is - something most people aren’t brave enough to admit. We are far from being a nation of equality.”

   What is it that people aren’t brave enough to admit?

   Its clear that there is more going on in this thread than just what was actually posted, too!!!

7. Emmy on July 15th, 2008 9:17 pm

   Right Field, I can speak from personal experience that this country is not near as far away from the times of segregation as it would like to believe. We have a nice illusion of unity and equal rights for all, but we are far from that in reality. His former pastors statements may sound racist, and if a white preacher had said them, I will admit he would have been strung up. But they got to people because they ring a little too true. We don’t like it when people mess with our created reality.

8. Right Field on July 15th, 2008 10:00 pm

   I thought that’s what you meant, but I didn’t want to assume. Oh, I know pretty well myself that racism still exists. Unfortunately, I think it always will. You’ll always have people who won’t be able to look past the color of someone’s skin, just as you’ll always have some folks who are anti-Semitic, or anti-Mexican, or whatever. However, I think there’s been a ton of progress over the past several decades. We’re not that far removed from the civil rights marches of the 60’s, and here we have a black man who has a good shot, and indeed is favored, to win the White House. I am under no illusions that his possible election means that everything is somehow forgotten, or that people’s prejudices have magically been erased, but I do think just the fact he’s this close means we’ve made tremendous strides.

   As for Rev. Wright, I’m curious to hear what statements of his that you think ring true. Government-created AIDS to kill black people? 9/11 was just America’s chickens coming home to roost? Black brains versus white ones? Or some others? I’m not trying to argue (well, maybe a little), just curious…

   You’re absoultely right that certain people create their own reality and that they don’t like that reality to be challenged. However, I think Rev. Wright, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, and others are as guilty of that as anyone. Their reality is one that is still stuck in the 60’s…the 1860’s. They see America through a prism of color, and nothing has changed that perception. We dismiss, and rightly so, the white supremacist who suggests that white people are superior to blacks…Rev. Wright, however, doesn’t seem to believe that people are the same (see the black brain vs white brain comment). He too is so focused on the color of skin that he can’t see beyond that.

9. Emmy on July 15th, 2008 10:16 pm

   Well perhaps I misspoke. Its not so much that the statements themselves are true, more that the sentiment behind them or the feeling that goes with them that is true. He’s angry, there’s not getting around that. Are his beliefs out there? You bet! But his anger is still very justified and I think that’s what people don’t like. We can look at people like Jackson, Sharpton, and Wright and write them off as wackos, but some part of what they say still hits home with us on some core level.

   We want to believe we’ve come father than we have. There’s no denying that we are world’s away from where we came, but when my own father joined the KKK I knew we still had light years to go. They may be nuts, but sometimes its the crazies that have some valid points.

   I want Obama to win and I think he has a great shot. People have told me that Obama supporters are looking for a savior. I don’t look at him in that way at all. We are in a mess we won’t be out of any time soon no matter who wins the election. Part of my support for Obama lies in what I think he can mean for our country because of his race and his background. Call me racist, but I think he can change the image of this country just with the color of his skin.

10. Right Field on July 15th, 2008 11:27 pm

    I can understand anger, I can understand bitterness…but at some point you have to recognize that it just isn’t the same country that it was even ten years ago, much less 40 or so. I am sure Rev. Wright told himself on many occasions that he’d never live to see a black man become President. Now, he has that chance…why can’t he and others embrace what that means and acknowledge the progress? The cynical part of me believes they don’t because it is within the racial divide that they find their power, but for some it is hard to let go of an anger that, while justifiable, has consumed them. At some point you have to let go of that, right?

    Now I know what you meant by speaking from personal experience. Certainly having a father in the KKK means that the racial divide, the prejudice and ignorance that goes with it, hit close to home. So, I can understand how you’d believe we’re still light years away…I think we’re a bit closer then that, but I’ll concede that you have good reason to feel that way. Is he still a member, or was this a ‘youthful indiscretion’?

    I’m not an Obama supporter (which probably comes as no surprise!); frankly, I just don’t like his politics, his voting record, and what I know of his policy proposals. With that said, I’m not a McCain supporter either…or Bob Barr…or whomever else is on there. Its a write-in year for me!! Its been interesting to watch thus far though.

    I have suspected that many of his supporters also feel as you do, that his race and background can indeed change America’s image. (I take some issue with needing to “change” America’s image, but that’s for another thread…) Honestly, it bothers me somewhat that people would vote even partly based on that…if we are to move beyond the racial divide, should that even be a consideration? I certainly wouldn’t call you a racist, or anyone else that felt the same, but it does seem to run contrary to his stated goal of being the candiate who bridges that divide.

11. Emmy on July 16th, 2008 5:54 am

    Well his color is certainly not the main reason I will vote for him, being a liberal, I do agree with his politics And of course that also means I do think America needs a new image. This country is not entirely made up of rich, old white men and the rest of the world needs to see that. Hillary could have accomplished the same thing on a different level, although I’m very glad that didn’t happen.

    My father (and I hesitate to call him that) joined the KKK just a few years back. I have no idea if he’s still a member as I no longer speak to him. I tell people about it only to raise awareness that it still exists and in larger numbers than one might expect. There were some very intelligent people, who when learning this, were shocked that they still exist.

    People do need to move on from the race issue. Rev. Wright needs to move on and my father needs to move on. But I think they both speak to the fact that so many haven’t. But who is more justified in their anger?

12. Emmy on July 16th, 2008 5:59 am

    Oh and I forgot to address whether his race should be an issue when he seeks to bridge the divide. Well, I think his race is an issue because he will bridge the divide. Someone has to be the first, and since that is him his race will be, and clearly already is an issue. I’d like him no matter what his race, its only an added bonus that he will help move the race relations in this country and others forward.

    He can bridge the divide and hopefully make it a non-issue for future candidates. Hillary made the White House just a bit closer for women. If McCain ends up winning, both Obama and Clinton did a whole lot for this country just by running.

13. Right Field on July 16th, 2008 9:52 am

    To be honest, I’ve never been much concerned with how those abroad view this country, so the fact that Obama’s possible election might change their minds about us is of no consequence to me. Regardless of our leadership, we’re still one of the most diverse countries on the face of the planet, certainly moreso than many of the European countries that now look down their collective noses at us. And on Hillary we do indeed agree…I’m very glad THAT didn’t happen either!

    While I haven’t had any personal experience with groups such as the KKK, nor known anyone that is/was a member, I never thought they they had completely vanished. Marginalized, I think, is a better word. I’m not surprised you don’t speak to your father anymore (I don’t talk to mine either, haven’t in years, but for different reasons)…it doesn’t sound like there’s much really to talk with him about.

    You’re right…between your father and Rev Wright, I’d guess the latter is probably much more justified in his anger. I doubt your father has experienced racism at the hands of a black man…he probably thinks he has, but that’s another matter altogether (and probably a good cause for some medication…). But, its what you do WITH that anger that is the key. In my opinion, that anger has bred hatred, and Wright found himself perpetuating the racial divide instead of doing anything to heal it. Al Sharpton? Same thing…there was a shooting in NYC where a young unarmed black man, Sean Bell, was gunned down by police, shot dozens of times. Sharpton turned that into a racial issue, leading folks in ‘Kill the Police’ rallies after their acquittal. The problem with that is two of the police officers doing the shooting were BLACK!

    I see your point regarding whether or not his race should be an issue in voting for him, at least partially. It just seems odd to me that to bridge the divide you almost have to be a part of it…not you personally, mind you, just those where his race is more than an added bonus. Perhaps an Obama Presidency will help move race relations forward…regardless, I am optimistic that the greatness of this country and our “goodness” will continue to overshadow and further marginalize both those who share your father’s views and, of course, those of the “race hustling” crowd (Wright, Sharpton, etc). I don’t want a country where groups like the KKK have any relevance whatsoever, nor do I want a society where we can’t even say ‘black hole’.

14. Frank J Witt on July 16th, 2008 10:23 am

    Emmy, I’m sorry but there is no way I can vote for Obama right now. He had Jackson on his side, unitl he wanted to “cut his nuts off” for talking down to the blacks…Obama’s support of the Global Poverty Act that would cost US taxpayers $843 BILLION dollars ontop of what we already donate to the less fotunate/starving populations. If these people haven’t figured out that making babies = less food for everyone else, then I don’t think we can afford to pay more in taxes to feed them. Inhumane as it sound…yeah I know…I don’t care where they are from either…if we can’t help American families then how can we be FORCED to feed the world?
    Then we have the “war” in Iraq. Sure, he was against it…so was I, but to deny the now famous SURGE didn’t work…did he fall and hit his head or is he just ignorant enough to not give a pat on the back for slwoing down the killings?…http://www.aim.org/don-irvine-blog/obamas-surge-mentality/
    Something even more disturbing that neither of the candidates even voted on…http://www.aim.org/aim-column/conservatives-protest-obamas-aids-bill/…$50 BILLION (in part)to fund forced abortions and sterilization and pay money to big wigs.

    I don’t know but I higly doubt you would feel great voting for Obama as the “feel good” vote bacuase it will supposedly bridge the gap. If you have been to any big city, there are cultural divides that exist to make sure each group of people take care of their own except in the black communities. Violence tears thru the neighborhoods and there is nothing we can do to stop it. Don’t beleive me, google the term “violenc ein black neighborhoods” and prepare to be amazed.
    Now to the New Yorker mag cover. Obama says it offended Muslim American…guess what…everyone is offended by every little thing…get over it. I do like the first comment and it spells out alot of what we have to look forward to IF a democrat is to win the White House…http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2008/07/16/2008-07-16_untitled__cover16m-1.html

    Sorry if you see this as either hate or insults toward you…I have neither and I happen to like reading your views, I just think you are wrond about Obama…but what do I know.

15. Frank J Witt on July 16th, 2008 10:25 am

    Sorry, I see the mis-spellings have followed me here.

16. Emmy on July 16th, 2008 11:09 am

    I’m not real sure I follow you Frank. All I can say is that neither McCain or Obama has a snowballs chance in hell of pulling us out of the mess we are in right now and so it is very likely that they will be a one term president because at the end of four years I doubt we are going to be much better off.

    I can’t really respond to much of what you said because I’m confused, but I will say that I am well aware of the problems that African Americans have within their own communities. Its not something that will be fixed any time soon. It is going to take a lot of work and a lot of strong black leaders (as Bill Cosby has recently done) standing up and calling them out before it is fixed.

    I will tell you that I did a report on crime and the media in college. Statistically speaking white on white and black on black crimes are much higher than black on white crimes, but the media covers black on white crimes tenfold. It’s awful hard to make a better name for yourself as a group when the media spins things the way they do and plays on the fears of people who are on the verge of feeling one way or the other about people who look differently than they do.

    I don’t want to live in a world where Rev. Wright, Jesse Jackson, or my father are right about race relations. But, if Obama accomplishes nothing else as a candidate or possibly as president, he has made people talk about things that aren’t quite fixed.

    And I’m sorry Frank, NO candidate in either party can fix things right now. McCain will do no better than Obama if elected. You vote your gut and I’ll vote mine and we can both keep our fingers crossed that something good comes out of four years.

17. Right Field on July 16th, 2008 2:30 pm

    If Obama is elected its likely he’ll have an even bigger Democrat majority in Congress to work with…wouldn’t that mean things could indeed improve in even four years time (if one believes that Dem policies are better), since they’ll have the ability to pretty much do what they want?

    McCain’s problem will be that Dem Congress, and the fact he doesn’t seem to have a coherent political philosophy. I hear conservatives say ‘Well, we’ll get conservative Supreme Court justices anyway’. Um, how so? They’d still have to be confirmed by the Senate, and no way a Roberts or Alito gets through a Dem Senate that may have as many as 60 votes.

18. Frank J Witt on July 16th, 2008 2:49 pm

    Emmy, I have been crossing my fingers so long, I look like I’m making gang signs…

    4 years hopefully nothing too terrible will happen. I like your ideas about race but I think with the “suburbanization” (yeah, I made that one up) of immigrants from any country, the lines will be drawn in the sand.

    Hope and wish…

19. Frank J Witt on July 16th, 2008 3:19 pm

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/16/us/politics/16poll.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin
    Check out the poll on the left but remember they only called 297 blacks whil;e calling over 1300 whites…irresponsible at best.

20. Whackette on July 16th, 2008 5:23 pm

    Obama’s run is going to bring the double standard to the forefront.

    The KKK is ugly and disturbing. So is Pastor Wright. If you wouldn’t vote for a member of the KKK, then why would you vote for a member of Pastor White’s church?

21. Right Field on July 16th, 2008 5:28 pm

    Are you referring to Obama’s former pastor?

22. Lowell on July 16th, 2008 5:42 pm

    Are you directly comparing active members of that church to active members of the Ku Klux Klan claiming no difference? Just wondering.

23. Whackette on July 16th, 2008 8:06 pm

    RF, yes.

    Lowell, there are some differences. But there are also some similarities. Hate is hate. I don’t understand why anyone would join a group like that– no matter what it’s called– unless they agree with it. I don’t want a person like that to run the country. And, no, I didn’t vote for George Allen. I apply this to republicans too.

24. Right Field on July 16th, 2008 9:52 pm

    That’s the thing…I don’t think Obama believes everything Wright was saying, but then again would you have such a close association, for such a long time, if you didn’t share at least some of the same views? I’ve heard Obama say what he disavowed regarding Rev. Wright…if that refers to everything, then how can you listen to that for so long?

    By the way, Whackette…was George Allen in the KKK?

25. Emmy on July 16th, 2008 9:52 pm

    Pastor Wright is his former pastor. I don’t agree with every single thing my pastor does or says… but then I’m not running for President. I don’t equate the two as equals though so that’s the difference. I think members of the KKK hate all races and religions other than their own, I don’t think Rev. Wright truly “hates” anyone or would treat them in the way that the KKK has treated people over the course of their history.

26. Right Field on July 16th, 2008 10:58 pm

    If I want to be generous, I can assume that maybe Obama saw the Wright rants as just a manifestation of his justifiable anger, and nothing more. But, even that has problems…does Obama share some of that anger? How much, and why? He said he found some of Wright’s views despicable. Did he ever talk to Wright about these them? And so on…

    Too bad I’m not in a generous mood, though!

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